[Sidney]

I like the parallel between Rory & Paris in this episode and it’s a great point, Sidney, that Paris was being dependent in a roundabout way by going to Yale.  Rory needs her mom like Paris needs Terrance to get settled in the first big day.  Lorelai took it a little further throwing a party for the whole floor but the end result was the same in helping them both to feel as comfortable as possible in their new environment.  I love the moment at the end when Rory confirms to the other girls which is the best coffee place thanks to Lorelai.  It’s a sign that not only will she be okay on her own but that Lorelai can be there for her even when she’s not physically there. 

MOAR info for you, Heidi   I logged in this morning using IE7 and had no troubles, all of the threads were loading just fine   I logged in just now using IE6 and the pages are loading a little slow but I am able to post.  Hope that helps!

In this episode it certainly appears that the thrill was in the chase as far as Jess was concerned.  He may have been more interested in getting Rory than actually having her.  That or Luke’s lecture about the proper way to treat a girl like Rory didn’t stick.  Lorelai was close to the line when telling him off for not calling Rory as he said he would but that would fall under taking off her fake-face and being straight with him.  Is it possible that Rory really does know Jess isn’t the type to kowtow to a schedule?  At this point it’s hard to picture them having a conversation to set the guidelines of their relationship with Rory’s inability to explain that she does live by a schedule. 

Caryn and Sidney, I couldn’t agree more that Rory was annoying in this episode.  I’m sure that she was disappointed in herself for doing what Lorelai advised her not to by being “that girl”.  I think she would have been regretful for not telling Jess how she really felt even if Lorelai hadn’t said anything and her forewarning only made it worse. 

I liked Emily and Trix’s resolution.  Their shared moment wasn’t cheapened even though Trix went back to being just as nasty as ever towards Emily.  Rather, it fits the Gilmore pattern of emotional progress taking one step forward only to take two back. 

The contrast between Dave/Lane and Rory/Jess is sharp.  Is there anything about Dave Rygalski that isn’t perfect for Lane’s first official boyfriend?  He might even rival Dean in the first boyfriend department. 

You covered this episode so well, Mel, it’s hard to follow! 

Sometimes, I think that what teens go through while they're figuring out who they are and what they want to do with their lives, clouds their vision of their parents and I wonder how much of that vision isn't still with Lorelai today? I'm not saying that Emily and Richard haven't done or said things that hurt and upset Lorelai. For those times, I completely understand where Lorelai is coming from. I came to appreciate their relationship a lot more during this viewing of the episode.

I think the point you make here is important and one of my favorite things about this episode is that we get to see how Lorelai’s relationship with them has grown.  Emily and Richard have both proved Lorelai’s points about them being manipulative and elitist time and time again but we are rarely shown their point of view favorably.  The flashbacks showed us that life back then was very much like their life as we see it.  Emily and Richard were busy attending functions and keeping up appearances, upholding the good Gilmore name.  Their interest is and was in what is best for their family as they see it regardless of anything else.  It’s how they see it that Lorelai takes issue with.  A lot of that stems from being a typical rebellious teenager but I think Lorelai and Christopher’s flashback conversation on the stairs is the key as well as Christopher’s model Dear John letter.  Emily and Richard never take into consideration what Lorelai wants. They make all of the decisions because they know what’s best and it’s one of the biggest problems Lorelai still has with them. To a point this is understandable, Lorelai and Christopher were kids but if they were old enough to get pregnant they were old enough to have a say in what happened.  Lorelai’s reasons for running away were that she didn’t fit comfortably into that Normal Rockwell painting which resulted in her hating her childhood (exaggerated or not) and she didn’t want Rory to be raised the same rigid way.  I think the flashback scenes we were given illustrated that point nicely. 

I also love that Lorelai brings Emily the DVD player at the end of the episode.  While it’s too late for apologies on everything else they went through back then and a DVD player is not quite an olive branch it shows that they can keep moving forward.  I also like that it shows Lorelai knows enough about the good sides of Emily to know exactly which DVDs to pick out.

I wonder just how much of Luke asking Nicole out was a result of Lorelai and how much was Jess.  It seems that most of it was Lorelai and even though Jess’ comments came first they only meant something when coupled with the fact that Lorelai had a date.   I also have to wonder if he didn’t have in inkling as to why Lorelai was all of the sudden interested in fishing. The way he half-grilled her about who she was going fishing with seemed to imply that he knew something was up and it wasn’t Sookie she had a fishing date with.  By contrast Mrs. Kim would surely never make the mistake of telling someone she was into an activity that she wasn’t, she’s so direct about absolutely everything. 

Lessa, my GG dead patch was Season 2

I think that with Lorelai’s sarcastic answers she did as much damage as she would have with honest, negative answers.  The damage perceived by Emily was the same either way.  At what point do you write off the feelings of the individual who feels hurt.  The fact that each of Lorelai’s answers was draped in sarcasm/attitude speaks volumes about her opinions.  I understand her refusal to lie under oath and that is admirable.  I think she could’ve tried a little harder to make it work favorably, or at least neutrally, for Emily.  “Gee, how much time do you have” in response to being asked to expand on Emily’s reasons isn’t even making an effort.  She could have named one or two instances and moved on.  I do agree that Emily’s lawyer would have prepped Lorelai.  I think the lawyer should have been invested in the outcome, the Gilmore’s are paying him/her after all.

Each instance does stem from how Lorelai, Rory and Sookie relate to others.  Sookie and Jackson are an exception in how it ended up because despite their usual bickering, when it comes to the serious stuff they definitely have a couple issues with communication.  When push comes to shove Lorelai comes out with it and so does Rory.  Things went a little too far in each situation but that could also be seen as picking their battles. 

Sookie, Lorelai and Rory all had different degrees of disloyalty here and Sookie’s seems to be the least harmful.  Sookie’s and Rory’s have less of a foundation in reality as well.  It's cute that Jackson automatically knows Sookie cheated/flirted by the few buttery actions she took.

I was reading through some of the comments in this thread and I noticed that the consensus seems to be that Paris believed exactly what Francie said about her and Rory’s “meeting”.  I had the impression that Paris didn’t believe what Francie was telling her about how and why the meeting went down.  The evidence was damning in that it confirmed Rory did meet with her in private manner.  That was what Paris took issue with; the actual occurrence of a meeting was the official betrayal.  The friendship betrayal was Rory practically confirming that Paris had a boyfriend.  Maybe Paris can be faulted for believing that part of it except for the fact that Rory did as much as verify it. Rory is still learning about the wonderful world of manipulation but it should have already started to sink in to a point where she wouldn’t play right into Francie’s hand like that. 

Lorelai’s deposition was of course humorous in the typical Lorelai-rant kind of way but the fact that everything about it would hurt Emily in every way overshadowed the humorous portions.  Lorelai can’t really have thought that Emily wouldn’t find out how it went.  This seems to be a complete contradiction to the previous episode where Lorelai proved that she has Emily’s back when push comes to shove.  It certainly almost tipped the scales back to neutral in showing that Emily isn’t the only one responsible for the constant one step forward two steps back that defines their relationship.  What stands out is the way Emily approached it at the end of the episode, they sort of continued down the path of the two of them airing their grievances without getting into a screaming match. 

All three actions raise the question of what betrayal is exactly and how it’s justified.  Sookie saw her non-actions as the worst possible betrayal where until called out Lorelai didn’t seem to give hers a second thought even after Rory rationalized how she should handle it.  Rory seems to be the only one who was levelheaded about the cause of her betrayal once she was confronted with it. 

Rory pheromones can be a powerful thing.  I’m not sure of the reasoning behind Dean being sincere with Rory.  Maybe he’s stuck at stage two: anger.  I’m tempted to say that for now revenge on Jess is the main motivation due to their two confrontations even though the nostalgia factor is very much present for both Rory and Dean. 

I also wonder about Richard standing up for Emily when it comes to Trix.  When we later find out about the letter she wrote to him on his wedding night it’s hard to imagine that he wouldn’t have responded.  Unless going through with marrying Emily was a response and he figured it was all that was necessary.  To make matters worse he laughs off Trix’s nasty comments towards Emily.  Perhaps that’s his coping mechanism. 

For me this episode is mostly about the Gilmore women and how they relate to each other.  Trix all the way down to Rory and most importantly the small amount of bonding that occurred between Emily and Lorelai.  It always amazes me how matter of factly Lorelai is able to explain her coping mechanism to Emily as well as how easily Emily accepts it.  She scoffed a little bit at Lorelai’s statement that she even takes a little pleasure out of Emily’s displeasure but it didn’t turn into an issue.  Emily channeled her inner Lorelai very well at dinner with Trix.  It also strikes me that despite Lorelai enjoying watching Emily squirm she is supportive which relates to the previous episode when Emily sort of accepted Lorelai’s disappointment at finding out Rory went ahead and applied at Yale.  She actually knew when to leave well enough alone for a change.  Sookie and Lorelai’s quick exchange in the kitchen about over the top perfection for the dinner with Trix matched Emily’s usual preparedness for the woman. 

Rory is at a point where she is literally having her cake (pie) and eating it too.  She’s learned well from Lorelai that if she doesn’t want to hear her mother’s comments about her relationships she should just leave her out of the loop.  I think she demonstrated a little bit of this when she didn’t care to discuss how she felt about Dean dropping off her things.  Of course Lorelai and Rory are different and Rory does seem to fill her in on everything at the end of the episode but I can’t ignore that little lesson she seems to understand a little more each season.  Rory and Emily both find a way to deal with their respective arch enemies head on.  Both Emily and Rory had tried the passive approach of smoothing things over and going with the flow.  Both also seem to have had enough of that tactic and took the aggressive stance for a change.  A little of Lorelai in all of them.   

I see a similarity in Francie and Dean in that they are being rather sneaky in this episode.  Scheming behind the scenes about staging their respective coups.   It’s nothing new for Francie but is a new, distasteful, side of Dean.  At the same time it’s hard to blame him for wanting to get a little revenge for all of the poking and prodding Jess was responsible for.

However if he had divulged the interview with the rest of his plan when he so deviously ambushed Rory in the kitchen it would have gone much smoother.  If Rory was true to her word and would have taken the interview just because he asked, she would have succeeded in convincing Lorelai that this was something that would be a good experience for her.

That’s the course of action Richard would have been best suited taking, laying all of it out for Rory in the kitchen.  I believe Rory would have agreed to it in the same manner that she agreed to the trip.  Rory wouldn’t have had the chance to talk Lorelai down in front of Richard.  Just like with the car from Dean.  Lorelai might have let Richard finish his spiel but I don’t think there would’ve been any reasoning with her about what he was saying until well after she put him back in his place and she and Rory were back in SH.  In which case they may not have gone to Yale with Emily and Richard on this trip but would have considered taking a (rescheduled) meeting with the dean of admissions on Lorelai’s terms. 

I was thinking about Luke’s lecture as it correlated to his relationship with Jess as opposed to with Rory.  I do agree that Luke gets way too overprotective of Rory and it can be strange.  To be fair, the whole town favors her a bit more than is normal.  Luke’s overprotective nature with her is the motivating factor and as a result, as it relates to Jess, he had to use his new strategy. 

Luke was naive the first time around with Jess.  He wanted to believe that Jess could, and had the desire to, do well in the SH environment.  He thought just getting him out of Liz’s house was enough to do the trick and that each talking-to and the simple act of having a good male role model was all it would take for Jess to straighten up.  He said himself that he didn’t realize how bad the situation was when he agreed to take Jess on.  He was, and still is in some ways, clueless and didn’t know how to parent a troubled teenager.  So the second time around he’s trying the structure approach. 

I don’t know, I’m not positive that Loreali would’ve had that reaction had Richard held a pow wow with everyone at dinner.  Richard leaving Lorelai out of the decision to take the trip to Yale was only one of the problems with the situation.  The main problem, and the one it always comes back to, is that Richard has no say in how Rory is raised and doesn’t get to make suggestions.  Plus, the fact remains that the words would be coming from Richard which results in Lorelai automatically shutting them out regardless of the approach.  I think she would have reacted similarly to how she reacted when Rory told her that Richard cornered Rory in the kitchen.  If Rory had let her, Lorelai would have marched back into the house and set Richard straight using the same backup she used when it was confirmed that he’d manipulated them.  I think he was right and if he’d approached Lorelai directly she would have shut him down (that doesn't excuse his tactics).  She might have gone to bed with the pamphlets anyway but I think it would have been just a variation of the same struggle getting to that point.

I agree that the focus here is Richard but first…

I love that someone steals Kirk’s trophy every year, I’d forgotten about that. 

Luke’s lecture to Jess was fantastic.  It's fun to watch Luke go from being a cheerleader of the Rory/Jess coupling to the paranoid guardian in a matter of minutes.  I imagine that having skipped the formative years of raising a kid it’s harder to just let it be as Lorelai was doing at the end of the episode.  Of course, imo, he’s justified to be suspicious but nonetheless it’s endearing. 

A little happy dance for Dean’s continued spinage

I swear Lorelai is the MacGyver of seamstresses.  Okay, what she did with that paper clip isn’t all that outstanding but who has a paper clip (among the several other items she had in there to use in a clothing pinch) in her purse?


Richard was on point with every defense he gave Lorelai for doing what he did.  Lorelai (as is confirmed later) is being short sided about Harvard.  And of course the “crazy” reason Richard spouted about Lorelai not wanting Rory to go to Yale because Richard went there is true (at this point anyway).  Rory had the correct response this time despite Lorelai being right about Richard having motives.  I’m a little surprised that Richard overlooked the fact that Rory would be wiling to take an appointment.  Once she agreed to take the trip to Yale without much reluctance he should have gone for the gold and asked about setting the appointment as well.  I don’t think Richard was betraying himself (the upbeat self) when defending his decision, unless I read that wrong lessa.  The two selves aren’t mutually exclusive. 

We did have one instance so far which lead to the idea that in another time and place Lorelai was Richard’s little girl (unless I’m getting episodes mixed up which does happen) when she called him “Daddy”.  I always interpret that to mean something.  I still find it hard to think of Lorelai’s early years as a hard life.  They weren’t perfect or even close to perfect.  I do think that she blocks out the good moments though, however sparse they were. 

I don’t mind Richard’s mention of Lynnie Lott.  He made his point, she was not the gal for him and didn’t hold a candle to Emily, especially in that dress   They could almost (almost, not quite) refer back to this moment later to calm at least one of Emily’s fears. 

I now have to find a way to burn the image of Emily and Richard in compromising positions out of my memory 

Ha, lessa, the picture I have in my head of a revenge notebook is more Billy Madison themed so it’s definitely scary.  I like your version better.

I blame Jackson’s perceived creepiness in this episode on Sookie.  She as much as admitted to phrasing her statement to Jackson as “so I was talking to Lorelai and she thinks four in four is preposterous”.  That’s not the way to approach the conversation.  When it comes down to it, after a certain extent it isn’t any of Lorelai’s business.  Other than providing support to her friend, Jackson was right, she doesn’t get a say in the matter.  Again, the way Sookie must have said it to Jackson made it sound like Lorelai’s opinion had changed her mind and the only person that should have an influence on how many kids a couple has and when they do it are the people that make up the couple.  I do think Jackson was avoiding the actual problem by taking it out on Lorelai as vehemently as he did but, imo, Sookie needed to approach that differently and leave Lorelai out of it. 

I thought the horse shot was the R/D relationship.  Now I’m really confused

I'd be okay with Luke cooking breakfast but not for the same reasons, Caryn.  I love a good old greasy spoon.


OT: Boy Meets World was a great show (not as good as Wonder Years), I’m not sure how they made it work with that sort of plot either though.  Guy gets girl, guy keeps girl.  Who wants to watch that?  Mr. Feeney must’ve been a big draw

I love the FND exchange in this episode.  It’s easy to forget about, being that it’s at the beginning and considering what happens at the end.  Emily actually tried to brighten Lorelai’s mood, picking up the Elizabeth Taylor comment, after she found out that Stanley was ditching her for the dance marathon.  Sure, it was in a total Emily sort of way but it was lighthearted nonetheless.  And then offering to let Lorelai make the asparagus talk, that’s some kind of breakthrough folks.  I love when Emily plays along. 
 
I think it’s interesting that Lorelai and Kirk are feuding so soon after their almost-date.  Perhaps Kirk took a little extra satisfaction out of beating the woman who turned him down, though it sounded like his demeanor was right on par given the descriptions of past dancathons.  I’ve always wondered why his dance partner didn’t do the victory lap with him. 
 
There is so much going on in this episode in the ways of relationships.  Paris and Jamie, Lane and Dave, the official ending of Rory and Dean which leads to the official beginning of Rory and Jess.  Nothing but negative sentiments come to mind with regards to Rory and her predicament so I’ll leave that one alone for now.  Both Paris and Lane were floundering their way through handling a boy that is interested in them (for the right reasons) for almost the first time.  I’ve never thought of Paris as sweet but when Jamie’s holding onto her hand I can’t think of a better way to describe her.  After she was sure he’d written her off as most boys do, so sure that he was in the revenge notebook (there is something truly frightening about the fact that she has a revenge notebook, which she keeps updated).  She’s still the in-your-face Paris we love, calling him out for his mistake (which not all women would), but she just seems so helpless as to how to respond to him in this moment that it is sweet.  Similarly Lane, while not as concerning as a revenge notebook of course, had nothing on Dave but a bunch of hung up phone calls.  Like Jamie, Dave showed up when hope of a relationship was faltering.  Any guy who can take Mrs. Kim on like that while simultaneously making plans to meet up with Lane is worth his salt.  Both of these guys are putting themselves out there where neither girl could. 

Sookie is very much like Paris and Lane as far as not having a lot of experience in the relationship department and floundering through dealing with sensitive situations.  I hate to see Sookie and Jackson fighting.  Really fighting not ‘these turnips are too small’ fighting, the latter is always a good time.  In this situation it’s healthy and all but they’re the rock and it’s just not supposed to happen.  If only Sookie could've siphoned a little of Paris’ umph a tad earlier and told Jackson her opinion up front instead of framing it as Lorelai’s.   
 

A couple of my favorite quotes from this episode that don’t have much meaning, they just hit me the right way this week:
 
Emily (at FND): Nobody likes chicken that much, Lorelai

 
Luke (in response to Taylor): If he asks for a free cup of coffee, gimpy’s going down.

I agree that Rory wouldn’t have mentioned corresponding with Christopher until he came up in one way or another, probably the birth of Gigi.  I also agree that Rory was probably not hurt as badly by Christopher going back to Sherry.  While it’s a lofty dream of hers for her parents to be together it was a romantic dream of Lorelai’s that had roots in reality.   

Sherry said Christopher came home a changed man after attending Sookie’s wedding with Lorelai.  But he was still a mess in Haunted Leg which was only a few episodes ago so he must be really good at hiding that fact.  I hate to don’t think that Christopher would directly lie to Sherry.  He hasn’t always been the most upstanding character but I can’t remember a time he out and out lied to anyone (maybe we need a reminder that Christopher tried to do the right thing for Lorelai as well once upon a time).  Its possible Sherry didn’t really consider the fact that Christopher hadn’t seen Rory much.  She’s pregnant and he’s so darn busy doting over her, who has the time?  Plus they started e-mailing I would assume very shortly after Haunted Leg so the summer is all he’d have to explain and Rory was in Washington.   Christopher can’t possibly be villainous, Sherry is as much at fault as he is for the unexpected pregnancy.  It takes two to tango and he didn’t know Sherry was pregnant when he and Lorelai decided to give it a go, he thought their relationship was over and all that was left was signing the papers (so to speak). 

It almost sounded like Sherry didn't expect Rory to be a regular part of their lives until she started Harvard (visiting-them-wise).  Being pregnant was requiring enough rearranging without figuring out how Rory fit into their lives while she was pregnant. 

I can definitely see that Sherry might have been pumping Lorelai for information on exactly how Christopher performed the 180.  There seemed to be a question mark at the end of every one of her compliments about "whatever you said".  Perhaps Sherry wanted to harness that sort of influence.